Puts me in mind, in a bad way, of radio's "Bob FM" over here. We used to have a nice loacl station that played "music from the Fifties, Sixties and Seventies" (if I remember listening to it properly). They replaced it with "Bob FM", which is basically a sizable computer on constant shuffle, full of music from "the Eighties, the Nineties, whatever" (from a voice that's supposed to sound "generic male" but comes off more "generic male jackass"). Apparently all those other radio stations playing the exact same kind of music just weren't enough. I dream of the day when I can put a sledgehammer through "Bob FM"'s hard drive...

But I digress. I brought it up 'cos the whole faux-chumminess that giving your shitty media outlet an ostensibly average name--and how come that in both examples, they're both names your imagination associates with white males (unless you actually know a counterexample)? Maybe I've just been spending too much time lurking at that feminist messageboard =P --well, it seems to me it's usually a sign of really apocalyptic, epic-scale shittiness. Especially if they're going for something "strong and noisy": "Hey, everybody knows a bloke named Dave--you know, that loud, overbearing, obnoxious shit-for-brains who clearly doesn't have two brain cells to rub together but who can't stop running his mouth off? He'd be the first to tell you he's the life and soul of the party and the funniest man alive! Don't you want to see that on your TV screens, too? Everyone loves Dave! Right? Right!?"

Why don't they just call it 'Bloke'?

Smelly vaginas are often a real turn-off.

Of course, my cock often comes up smelling of roses.

Well, it sounds like just another attempt to pigeonhole the most creative/productive demographic of men into something easily digestible for a media company clearly so unbeliveably narrow minded they probably wander down the street giving puzzled glances at mixed race couples and shitting their own pants at the choice of topping in Pizza Fucking Express.

Also, I find it downright offensive. Men are already under attack from all corners by the media who are continually attempting to make it bizarre/unacceptable for young males to be interested in anything not related to bristols, cash, mechanics, war and/or autofellatio. And AND Where's Davina - not her off Big Brother, but the women's version?! I mean, daytime TV is arguably hugely dominated by programmes designed to appeal to women (well, housewives and students) but it's also ALL SHITE (I don't care how much you fancy the hosts on Loose Women, Cappsy) whereas Never Mind The Buzzcocks is excellent.

I wonder what Bill Bailey would make of it.

They should just have called it "Made By Cunts".

Cor you can be a moany old bunch. It's a silly name, but it's still easier to digest than 'UKTVGVheebeejeebee' or whatever. As for it being offensive, oh come on! Just because it has a male name and is targetting a set audience. Also...

> Men are already under attack from all corners by the media who are continually attempting to make it bizarre/unacceptable for young males to be interested in anything not related to bristols, cash, mechanics, war and/or autofellatio.

Maybe so, but their are first worse culprits for this kind of thing, for example FHMtv and Bravo. I'm all for a Davina but it's up to another channel to find that audience rather than the people behind 'Dave' to automatically provide one. One really benefit after all is I won't have to see any ads for Shiela's wheels.

But, Karl, Dave is the single shittest name any channel has ever been given. At least with UKTV G2 the name has meaning and a reason. It's a proper channel name, not the name fo a cunt down the pub that some equally cunting TV executive thinks is a revolutionary idea. What the fuck is Dave supposed to even mean? It's just bollocks, blokey pigeon holing SHIT and, to be honest, you should be deeply offended that a channel that probably catered for you before is turning into this...

Turning into what though, the same thing only with a 'gimmick' name? I can still think of far worse offences. What DID UKTVG2 actually stand for then?

Besides...

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=QbXPHiyE7uE

If 'Dave' were likely to show anything with that much wit, then I'd be happy. As Cappsy says, it's just another attempt to pigeonhole men into this 'lad' persona that marketing people love so much, and which does either sex no favours. It's also another slap round the face for women who like shows that marketing people like to assume are for men. In a society where female footballers are getting more (deserved) attention, it seems to be rather retrograde and playing to the fears of some men who aren't aware that attitudes have changed.

> What DID UKTVG2 actually stand for then?

United Kingdom Television Gold Two.

> Turning into what though, the same thing only with a 'gimmick' name? I can still think of far worse offences. What DID UKTVG2 actually stand for then?

I'm not sure what UKTVG2's key demographic was, but I get the impression that it's *changing* to the male 16-34 audience, which would suggest a change in programming, too. We'll see, anyway.

The old name was a little silly, but it was only like that because the 'UK' range of stations changed to 'UKTV'. At least it fucking *meant* something.

DAAAAAVE!!!!!!!!!!!1

You remember that from the league of gentlemen hah that was wiked.

Yes.

>>> If 'Dave' were likely to show anything with that much wit, then I'd be happy. As Cappsy says, it's just another attempt to pigeonhole men into this 'lad' persona that marketing people love so much, and which does either sex no favours. It's also another slap round the face for women who like shows that marketing people like to assume are for men. In a society where female footballers are getting more (deserved) attention, it seems to be rather retrograde and playing to the fears of some men who aren't aware that attitudes have changed.

See this the thing. There seem, perhaps rightly to have been this backlash at aiming a channel at a 16-34 male demographic. When in effect nothing appears to have changed. The article above implies that was UKTVG2's demographic before. All they've done is come up with a new gimmick to re-focus their targetting of that demographic. I could understand the fears if 'Dave' was to suddenly become another Bravo or Men & Motors, but I'm just flicking through Monday nights schedule.

Whose Line is it Anyway (the slattery era), Top Gear, QI, Buzzcocks, HIGNFY and Coupling. Okay so it's not a documentary on Germaine Greer or Matthew Bourne's Swan Lake but it's basically all the shows that used to be shown on BBC2 and Channel 4 on a friday night MINUS the 'lad' crap like The Girlie Show and the cheesy action machismo that used to be shown on BBC1/ITV in those timeslots.

Well, I've watched this quite a bit over its first two days and it's certainly a very good channel. The repeats of HIGNFY, Question Of Sport and Top Gear could be a lot older than they are, though, as watching stuff from justa couple of years ago can be plain boring. The Whose Line Is It Anyway 1993 repeats are just brilliant, though.

Plus, Red Dwarf VI starts tomorrow night!

Still, the name is still a bag of CUNT.

> Plus, Red Dwarf VI starts tomorrow night!

I was surprised how much I liked the repeats of early Who's Line... (having recently seen the American version on a different channel and finding it cringe-making), and how little I connected with Red Dwarf. Red Dwarf used to be my favourite series but I've not bothered getting the DVDs as yet, and now I'm glad because seeing Psirens about a week ago it seemed very laboured and formulaic. I guess that's what people mean when they say they "grow out of Red Dwarf"? - I've always shaken my head at this in the past but now I understand - you can see the gags a mile off and the characters are pretty one-dimensional. I can also see why the BBC would want to wash their hands of this, as I gather they are trying to do by refusing to make more and giving it away to this channel. It's a very old fashioned series, which while good for its time is now a historical artifact rather than the fresh comedy it was in its day.

Dave has just started 'Alpha Male Sundays' full of programs for MEN. Plus the adverts for Totally Viral beggar belief.

To put it simply, the presentation and continuity is starting to fuck me off no end.

I just hate getting BBC programmes with adverts. Red Dwarf is a 40 minute programme on Dave.

BBC programmes have adverts on all UKTV channels though; that's not really the problem. I have tried to watch Dave, but as Cappsy says, the whole ethos behind the presentation is pretty offensive to either gender. Which is a shame, because it's actually quite nicely produced otherwise.

As for 'growing out of Red Dwarf', Lantern, bear in mind that, unlike a lot of sitcoms, RD has a lot of variation of theme and humour in its run. There really is something for everyone, so I tend to feel that people who feel that they've 'grown out of it' haven't really tried to get back in it in the first place. Which is up to them, but they're missing out.

"The home of Witty Banter (TM) *wink*"

I hate it.

"Witty" and "banter" don't even fit together in the same sentence. Witty is sharp; banter is drunken and twattish. Dave sounds like a cock and I never want to meet him.

Yeah, I really fucking hate the word "banter". It's used by cretins to describe "saying mean things about people".

Yes - banter suggests "people verbally shoving one another" to me. But in that cunty laddish way that suggests they're all having a great time taking part, even the person getting shoved.

That's not to say I don't slag off my own friends, of course - which probably makes me a hypocrite - but, I don't know, the word "banter" just makes me think of the Sixth Form common room at my old school, where all the dickheads would just be twats and call it that.

It's just banter, Martin, harmless banter.

"Banter" reminds me of great regional news presenters. And Bill and Sian being fucking brilliant on Breakfast. It's used a lot on TV pres forums.

> Red Dwarf VI starts tomorrow night!

Gunmen of the Apocalypse was on Dave last night, and funnily enough they showed the edited version from years back. After Lister is removed from the AR console there was an abrupt cut to the cockpit just before they would have had the "she's not jailbait, she was 16" exchange.